An open & honest offer to the board...

[Head Boy]

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

Yes HB I do have other sites doing better than 1-50. Paysites do that.

Surely you don't mean the guys who leak affiliates traffic from other sites before it gets to the signup page.

So, let me get this straight, you are saying that the two types of sites that get the best sales ratios both grab affiliates traffic during the signup process.

It's no wonder that affiliates are complaining about falling sales ratios.

[Paul Markham]

Originally Posted by Tuula

Paul, you are the definition of "small people", you cheat your affiliates, you ban them for sending you too much traffic, you've got more leaks than a 50 year old rusty faucet, you spam the board consistantly, you weasle out of everything, you can not handle criticsm worth a shit, you think you know everything.

And now you're trying to give someone else 3RD RATE advice on how to run a paysite with an affiliate program and you think that any of us are going to sit back and watch you do this.. I don't think so, call me a flamer all you want because your opinion of me, does not affect me, because in order for that to hurt it would have to come from someone that had some VALUES and we all know you don't! And at least I'm not the one ripping people off, YOU are the one guilty of that!

and your defense is always the same thing "you're lying"

But you are a liar and my picture proves it or is that wrong as well?

You are a liar. Go find the leaks on my tour or you are a liar.

I do not think I know everything, I don't have a clue how to program, design and other things. So again you are a liar.

It's not an opinion you proved yourself a liar. Thanks for fucking up a perfectly good thread with your lies.

[Tuula]

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

But you are a liar and my picture proves it or is that wrong as well?

You are a liar. Go find the leaks on my tour or you are a liar.

I do not think I know everything, I don't have a clue how to program, design and other things. So again you are a liar.

It's not an opinion you proved yourself a liar. Thanks for fucking up a perfectly good thread with your lies.

I don't need to prove anything Paul and I hardly proved myself a liar, EVERYONE here has seen and read about the things you have done! YOU ARE THE LIAR AND A THIEF to boot, now carry on with your third rate advice, next week you'll be opening a new site on how to run a successful paysite and affiliate program. I can't wait to see that one! Oh and i love how you twist things around and ask for LB's advice, if I recall correctly last week you were slinging him through the mud. "I don't like him Tuula!"

[Paul Markham]

Originally Posted by Head Boy

Surely you don't mean the guys who leak affiliates traffic from other sites before it gets to the signup page.

So, let me get this straight, you are saying that the two types of sites that get the best sales ratios both grab affiliates traffic during the signup process.

It's no wonder that affiliates are complaining about falling sales ratios.

Affiliates are losing sales because over the years they and sponsors plain LIED to surfers who now no longer trust their spin. You don't get it because it does not fit into your argument.

Surfer sees a site and thinks it's interesting. He then goes to the site to look and then goes to a reviewer site to see what it says about the site. On seeing a good review he goes back to the paysite, on the review sites link. The review site gets the sale.

If he sees no review he might not sign up at all, he doubts the word of the affiliate and sponsor. He might stay on the review site and keep looking there. Or he goes straight to the review site to check out the affiliate sales promo.

What ever way you cut it the surfer does not trust the first guy promoting the site or and the sponsor. The surfer NEEDS the back up of a review site. Now who's fault is that?

Post proof of your theory.

[Head Boy]

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

Affiliates are losing sales because over the years they and sponsors plain LIED to surfers who now no longer trust their spin. You don't get it because it does not fit into your argument.

Surfer sees a site and thinks it's interesting. He then goes to the site to look and then goes to a reviewer site to see what it says about the site. On seeing a good review he goes back to the paysite, on the review sites link. The review site gets the sale.

If he sees no review he might not sign up at all, he doubts the word of the affiliate and sponsor. He might stay on the review site and keep looking there. Or he goes straight to the review site to check out the affiliate sales promo.

What ever way you cut it the surfer does not trust the first guy promoting the site or and the sponsor. The surfer NEEDS the back up of a review site. Now who's fault is that?

Post proof of your theory.

Wow - that's more or less exactly what I've been saying over the last couple of years.

Affiliates buy content to promote paysites, and surfer get pissed off because the girl they wanted isn't there. Sponsors build small multiple sites so that they can pick up memebers and make unaffiliated sales.

Review sites became popular because they filled a need, and surfers have started to rely on their opinions before they make signups. This doesn't help the honest affiliates who are losing their hard won quality traffic, and it doesn't help sponsors who have to give up half their sales income to avoid losing the purchasing traffic they have already bought.

[Paul Markham]

Originally Posted by Head Boy

Wow - that's more or less exactly what I've been saying over the last couple of years.

Affiliates buy content to promote paysites, and surfer get pissed off because the girl they wanted isn't there. Sponsors build small multiple sites so that they can pick up memebers and make unaffiliated sales.

Review sites became popular because they filled a need, and surfers have started to rely on their opinions before they make signups. This doesn't help the honest affiliates who are losing their hard won quality traffic, and it doesn't help sponsors who have to give up half their sales income to avoid losing the purchasing traffic they have already bought.

Lots more BS. Where did you get the data for this? "Affiliates buy content to promote paysites" I assume you have proof of this and not blowing more smoke up our asses. Do you run a content store?

But at least you accept the fact that the surfer no longer trusts the other means of driving traffic enough to make it possible that you're right.

So lets accept everything you say is true. What do sponsors and affiliates do about it? Do sponsors kiss goodbye to the sales review sites can offer or do affiliates refuse to promote sites that have reviews?

Give us solutions not problems.

Anyone notice Tuula has not posted proof I'm a always bitching? Not enough time, just got time to be bitching on Netpond.

[Rofl]

This was FUNKYMONKEE's thread.

It's not his fault PM waded in and sparked yet another flame war!

If I was you funkymonkee, start a fresh thread and leave them to it in here!

[Paul Markham]

Originally Posted by Rofl

This was FUNKYMONKEE's thread.

It's not his fault PM waded in and sparked yet another flame war!

If I was you funkymonkee, start a fresh thread and leave them to it in here!

I gave honest advice, something no one else has done. Advice no one has contradicted or added to.

So please when you read the above look for who started the flaming.

My advice still stands.
If you have good porn content that converts and a site that works you have a good chance of picking up affiliates who will drive traffic to you. You will find the top guys like review sites do not ask for much in the way of tools and support. It's about how much they earn from you. If they don't earn they will move on.

I will not reply to those who just flame. New Years resolution.

If I was you funkymonkee I would start another thread and see who gives you advice. Maybe some of the flamers will come up with something.

[Head Boy]

Paul - please stop posting round in circles about stuff you don't understand.

Stick to advice on producing sweaty betty wrappers.

[Paul Markham]

Originally Posted by Head Boy

Paul - please stop posting round in circles about stuff you don't understand.

Stick to advice on producing sweaty betty wrappers.

So I'm asking you what do you advise sponsors and affiliates to do?

Give us solutions not problems. Give everyone some advice on what action to take.

If you have advice.

[Head Boy]

I've already stated that sponsors and affiliates should avoid promoting the sites that lose their sales credits. I've also said that sponsors offering pps should be viewed with caution, especially if the payments are above commercial viability. I've also said that affiliates shouldn't use FHGs or tours with email harvesters or review links on them. Another point I've made for years is that sites shouldn't be promoted with misleading advertising. Yet another suggestion was that sponsors should focus on quality sites rather than multiples in the same niche that could lose affiliate tracking.

If that isn't enough, I started a thread about gathering stats on exits and returns during the pathe to a signup, and that was pretty much ignored. I've also suggested using cookies to try to get some idea of affiliate link loss. There are a bunch of other suggestions I've made over the years.

I think I'm the wrong guy to accuse of failing to come up with suggestions - I seem to be the one who makes the most effort in this, and I continue in the face of constant flaming.

[ScreaM]

funkymonkee
Is that an electrical-bike in your avatar?

[Paul Markham]

Originally Posted by Head Boy

I've already stated that sponsors and affiliates should avoid promoting the sites that lose their sales credits.

What if review sites help get sales?

What if the surfer would not of signed up to the site if it had not had a good review? Do I have to give up the sale because you say it's so?

I am prepared to accept the surfer looks on your site, where your sales pitch is, in some cases, unable to sell him completely. In fact all you do is generate enough interest for him to go look on the site of the person he trusts. (Sensible people at this point are asking themselves why the surfer is looking at sites he does not trust, but let's not go there.)

So you generated the interest, much like a telephone cold caller for double glazing, the review site closed the sale and you want the credit or you want us to lose the sale all together and all the sales the review sites generate by having so much trust from surfers.

So I as a sponsor have to ban the review sites from being an affiliate and you will send me 100 joins a week to replace this traffic. Done deal, sign up and start sending the traffic. You are prepared to back up your claims and replace the sign ups I lose. This is just me, how will you compensate everyone else?

Or just blowing smoke up our arses with zero to lose. You give out advice based on cock eyed theories, no proof and no common sense. You will not replace the sign up the sponsors or affiliates lose by following your advice and even when it's shown how stupid it is you side step the issue.

Now do you see why you are being flamed?

[Head Boy]

Paul - I stated that your post was what I have been saying for the last couple of years, and you are now saying it was a load of bollocks (that's your post). Is it any wonder that people don't take your comments seriously.

now. I considering running a book on the content of your replies.

1:10 - I'm out of this thread (every PM thread needs at least 2 posts that include this.

1:1 - Give me solutions, not suggestions. This one is at evens because it already appears in this thread.

10:1 - Quality traffic makes sales. This is at shorter odds than one would expect because you have already said that by picking up pre-qualified traffic from affiliates, review sites provide quality traffic.

1000:1 - failure to make a sale is the fault of the sponsor. We all know that you believe that sponsors can do no wrong when it comes to selling - it's all the fault of those lazy affiliates.

[hardcoreblogger]

oh man it's getting so fucking boring reading the same bullshit in every other thread, no matter what the original topic is.

funkymonkee i wish ya good luck with your biz! if i were you i'd look for a suitable partner to start one or several paysites with.

[Head Boy]

Sorry HCB - I'll put my comments on a site, and people can comment about that if they want to. It gets a bit tedious having to make the same posts time after time.

[hardcoreblogger]

fair enough mate i wasn't only addressing you...

[pam]

No wonder people are leaving Netpond.

If Paul isn't hijacking a thread to spam and boast of his high earnings, HeadBoy is posting to slam review sites and owners as thieves stealing from hard-working affiliates, which is what they are anyway.

There is so much bullshit in this thread you need hip boots to wade through it.

Nice way to welcome back an old Netponder, guys.

[pam]

Originally Posted by Head Boy

This is a great way to give away half your income, and to get reported as having crap sales ratios. Of course the review sites will contradict this and say that ratios are great.

What is the difference between giving away half your income to a review site or giving away half your income to someone who submits galleries?

Each is an affiliate.

Can you show me proof that review site ratios are crap? Since you keep claiming that we lie when we say we have good ratios? I mean, back up the bullshit you keep spewing. We can post screenshots of ratios very easily.

[Head Boy]

I feel quite passionately about the way the role of affiliates has been exploited, and I think it's time that it was opened up for discussion. Vested interests such as you tend to try to trash my views, but anyone who can read between the lines can see that there is some truth in my views. I agree that I may post about it too much, but it is an important issue, and it should be possible to discuss it openly. Paul's comments as a sponsor, plus several others, indicate that it is an issue that is being suppressed. For the sake of the industry, I think it should be possible to discuss things on a general board like Netpond.